"Big O," Roger Smith's self-made hell

"Roger the Wanderer" is one of the two episodes I haven't seen. After seeing it, Act 26 makes a lot more sense. If there are any future episodes, they'll have to revisit "Wanderer." It's making me wonder if Roger Smith, a failed attorney and war veteran, is a man living in a world where the fantasy-fulfillment technology seen in "Minority Report" is at a far more advanced level. Somehow, he has become addicted to it and has destroyed or forsaken his own life. This is ironic, however, because the company which owns the fantasy technology is secretly monitoring his simulation and using it to create a franchise based on Roger Smith's imagined life.

Sadly, his ratings have fallen and by now, Roger has worn out his welcome. No longer usefull to the company, Roger is unable to pay the fees and is thrown out into the street of the city on which he has based his fantasy. Angel Rosewater, a worker for the company who has been monitoring and directing his computer-assisted fantasies for him has been supporting his habit because of her love for his previous heroic actions in the military. Realizing that Roger can no longer handle reality in his current state, she rushes out into the city to save him (ever the Guardian Angel) before he gets hurt or killed.

Angel sedates him in her car and then returns him to his imaginary world, realizing that it is the only real one to him now. Somehow she will manage to scrape together enough money to support him and her. Perhaps that rich girl wearing a red dress she saw earlier could be of help. She also figures that perhaps it might be possible to telegraph to Roger ever so subtlely that his world is not real, in the hopes of someday helping him escape his self-made prison.

As we all know, however, Roger is totally clueless. He can't take a hint. Eventually, desperately in love, Angel tires of the wait and tries to pull the plug from his head to free him. But she wants to justify it to him before doing so, creating the character of a super megadeus able to erase the entire world. Realizing to a small degree that his world is about to be destroyed, the failed attorney attempts to "negotiate" with the bot.

But Angel will not be swayed. She pulls the plug and disconnects Roger. Unfortunately, he has become too sucked in by the simulation. Angel sees this and realizes that the only way Roger Smith can survive is through his virtual self. Not wanting to see the man she loves institutionalized and thinking it wrong to throw a human life away (she is a devout Christian, after all), Angel decides to plug Roger back in and restart things to a happier point in his virtual life.

---

It's tragic, but I think it covers most of the bases, I believe. "Big O" has always had a forlorn quality to it beneath the robot action. If this is anywhere close to what the "Big O" staff had it mind, I think it would be very hard to persuade them to do another season.

Do you think I missed anything? I was blown away by "Roger the Wanderer." It was fantastic. Even better than "Winter Night Phantom."

You stated in the linking to this that you think there will be no more Big O. If this operates on that premise, then bad move, because if CN puts up the money the makers have no CHOICE but to make more.

I douibt they would lock themselves in that way.

It's no worse than any other theory that swaps the roles of dream sequences and reality, and thus denies the meaning of everything that was important to us.

Well, you're right that they would be required to if CN wanted it, but I think that _if_ I'm right in any major way, it would be considered kind of lame by the creators who likely would consider that the story has run its course. I hope I'm wrong, though.

Then why then would they have agreed to the option in the contract?

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Originally posted by Pythagoras Well, you're right that they would be required to if CN wanted it, but I think that _if_ I'm right in any major way, it would be considered kind of lame by the creators who likely would consider that the story has run its course. I hope I'm wrong, though.

If they had a Season 3 in mind, they would have put plot hooks in Season 2. Such as Dastun being attracted to Angel (a theme that they reinforce multiple times but do not resolve). After Act 26, you won't be able to separate Roger and Dorothy with a crowbar, so something will have to be done about Angel. The Angel/Dastun relationship seems to have been set up for this. Similarly, for a Season 3, they might want to introduce a new mystery. If old mysteries haven't yet been resolved by the end of Season 2, then it would be nice if the Season 3 mystery were a superset of the Season 1-2 history/amnesia mystery.

So they put in an Event that is obviously similar to the Event that happened 40 years ago, but which, this time, has been witnessed by the main characters (and the audience) and will, in Season 3, be remembered by them. They'll investigate in Season 3.

Add our growing realization that Megadeuses are much more intelligent and have more will than we generally thought, and that Dorothy's Megadeus connection goes deeper than we previously realized (as seen by the probe cables), and that Megadeuses are resistant to whatever it is that Big Venus did (she had to get awfully close to Big Fau and Big O before anything happened to them), and you realize that there's not only an awful lot left undone, but that all the central mysteries are related. It's all got something to do with memory and Megadeuses and Dominuses and androids and a terrifying variability in what's real and what ain't.

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Originally posted by A Clockwork Tomato quote: Originally posted by Pythagoras Well, you're right that they would be required to if CN wanted it, but I think that _if_ I'm right in any major way, it would be considered kind of lame by the creators who likely would consider that the story has run its course. I hope I'm wrong, though. If they had a Season 3 in mind, they would have put plot hooks in Season 2. Such as Dastun being attracted to Angel (a theme that they reinforce multiple times but do not resolve). After Act 26, you won't be able to separate Roger and Dorothy with a crowbar, so something will have to be done about Angel. The Angel/Dastun relationship seems to have been set up for this. Similarly, for a Season 3, they might want to introduce a new mystery. If old mysteries haven't yet been resolved by the end of Season 2, then it would be nice if the Season 3 mystery were a superset of the Season 1-2 history/amnesia mystery. So they put in an Event that is obviously similar to the Event that happened 40 years ago, but which, this time, has been witnessed by the main characters (and the audience) and will, in Season 3, be remembered by them. They'll investigate in Season 3. Add our growing realization that Megadeuses are much more intelligent and have more will than we generally thought, and that Dorothy's Megadeus connection goes deeper than we previously realized (as seen by the probe cables), and that Megadeuses are resistant to whatever it is that Big Venus did (she had to get awfully close to Big Fau and Big O before anything happened to them), and you realize that there's not only an awful lot left undone, but that all the central mysteries are related. It's all got something to do with memory and Megadeuses and Dominuses and androids and a terrifying variability in what's real and what ain't.

I've always believed that they COULD make a Season 3 if they wanted to or were forced to. The character development points you stated are all left up in the air as you stated. There are also a lot more. But Angel has to either be gone temporarily or to have wiped herself in order for the metaplot to be plumbed any further.

But, if my explanation (or the other one about Roger being a prisoner) is somewhere in the ballpark, I think it's not completely unsatisfying. It raises even more philosophical questions and in a way is unique (so far as I've seen) in having a hero who is virtually helpless in the real world. It's a dimension that I don't think has been explored very sufficiently in the comic book/anime genre. The first Max Payne game plays around with the issue a little bit but then abandons it w/o resolution.

All that said, I think that the authors do owe the fans the courtesy of either making a movie, more episodes or another CD play to clue us in to the mystery of Paradigm.

BTW, I think you're wrong about Roger and Dorothy becoming romantically involved. This will never happen since it would destroy one of the most compelling aspects of the show, the never-to-be-resolved romantic tension between the two. They could get together but it would cheapen their characters and go against all of the mores we see in Paradigm about the uneasy relationship that androids and humans have with each other. Roger has the same aversion to loving a mere machine. He thinks there is something fundamentally wrong (we're not told exactly how) with eroticism toward a mechanical duplicate of a human.

Gotta love Roger's denial, though he seems to slip quite a little on the fundamentally wrong part after Negotiation with the Dead, which goes blatantly against the norms you mention.

I wouldn't go so far as to call wrapping up the relationship 'cheapening', especially not if there was another plot point like Dorothy's core memory being stolen thrown into it. Nobody can be in denial forever. Besides, you could always just leave it in as an endgame.

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Originally posted by X Prime Gotta love Roger's denial, though he seems to slip quite a little on the fundamentally wrong part after Negotiation with the Dead, which goes blatantly against the norms you mention. I wouldn't go so far as to call wrapping up the relationship 'cheapening', especially not if there was another plot point like Dorothy's core memory being stolen thrown into it. Nobody can be in denial forever. Besides, you could always just leave it in as an endgame.

Well, I haven't seen "NWTD" yet. It's the other one I haven't seen. Perhaps I'll have to revise things.

I wouldn't mind a Dorothy-Roger romantic connection in the very last episode, if it were done right. But it's so easy for a show to screw that up--"Who's the Boss" being a perfect example.

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Originally posted by Pythagoras Roger has the same aversion to loving a mere machine. He thinks there is something fundamentally wrong (we're not told exactly how) with eroticism toward a mechanical duplicate of a human.

I would agree if Dorothy was a mere machine, Roger would have an aversion to making love to her. I doubt he would put his life on the line for a toaster or a washing machine. His over protectiveness and his sentiments for Dorothy shows he genuinely cares for her.

As for a sexual relationship, this certainly is a touchy subject. Would he have a sexual relationship with an artificial duplicate of a human? He seems to love for her dearly (forsaking Angel, erecting a bier for her (certainly something a person wouldn't do this for a toaster)). She "seems" to love him, not only saying it (Act 9), but displaying on occasion. So, can we assume that they would have a sexual relationship? I think this is up for conjecture.

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Originally posted by tvperez quote: Originally posted by Pythagoras Roger has the same aversion to loving a mere machine. He thinks there is something fundamentally wrong (we're not told exactly how) with eroticism toward a mechanical duplicate of a human. I would agree if Dorothy was a mere machine. I doubt he would put his live on the line for a toaster or a washing machine. His over protectiveness and his sentiments for Dorothy shows he genuinely cares for her. As for a sexual relationship, this certainly is a touchy subject. Would he have a sexual relationship with an artificial duplicate of a human? He seems to love for her dearly (forsaking Angel, erecting a bier for her (certainly something a person wouldn't do this for a toaster)). She "seems" to love him, not only saying it (Act 9), but displaying on occasion. So, can we assume that they would have a sexual relationship? I think this is up for conjecture.

I don't think Dorothy has the proper.. hmm..you know.. .. for a sexual relationship.

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Originally posted by Piano Black I don't think Dorothy has the proper.. hmm..you know.. .. for a sexual relationship.

I'd point out only that this is an anime, and therefore Dorothy has whatever "hmm...you know" the creative team decides she has.

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Originally posted by Piano Black quote: Originally posted by tvperez quote: Originally posted by Pythagoras Roger has the same aversion to loving a mere machine. He thinks there is something fundamentally wrong (we're not told exactly how) with eroticism toward a mechanical duplicate of a human. I would agree if Dorothy was a mere machine. I doubt he would put his live on the line for a toaster or a washing machine. His over protectiveness and his sentiments for Dorothy shows he genuinely cares for her. As for a sexual relationship, this certainly is a touchy subject. Would he have a sexual relationship with an artificial duplicate of a human? He seems to love for her dearly (forsaking Angel, erecting a bier for her (certainly something a person wouldn't do this for a toaster)). She "seems" to love him, not only saying it (Act 9), but displaying on occasion. So, can we assume that they would have a sexual relationship? I think this is up for conjecture. I don't think Dorothy has the proper.. hmm..you know.. .. for a sexual relationship.

I think that also is a subject up for conjecture.

And in a worst case scenariio we can rebuild her. We have the technology. Better, stronger, more...*ahem*...functional than before.

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Originally posted by Big Ben quote: Originally posted by Piano Black quote: Originally posted by tvperez quote: Originally posted by Pythagoras Roger has the same aversion to loving a mere machine. He thinks there is something fundamentally wrong (we're not told exactly how) with eroticism toward a mechanical duplicate of a human. I would agree if Dorothy was a mere machine. I doubt he would put his live on the line for a toaster or a washing machine. His over protectiveness and his sentiments for Dorothy shows he genuinely cares for her. As for a sexual relationship, this certainly is a touchy subject. Would he have a sexual relationship with an artificial duplicate of a human? He seems to love for her dearly (forsaking Angel, erecting a bier for her (certainly something a person wouldn't do this for a toaster)). She "seems" to love him, not only saying it (Act 9), but displaying on occasion. So, can we assume that they would have a sexual relationship? I think this is up for conjecture. I don't think Dorothy has the proper.. hmm..you know.. .. for a sexual relationship. I think that also is a subject up for conjecture. And in a worst case scenariio we can rebuild her. We have the technology. Better, stronger, more...*ahem*...functional than before.

You wouldn't see anything strange in humping a piece of metal? Roger sure does.

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Originally posted by Piano Black I don't think Dorothy has the proper.. hmm..you know.. .. for a sexual relationship.

From THE GREATEST VILLAIN:

BECK: Is your oh-so-precious Dorothy ... Roger's lover? [giggles]

ROGER: That's preposterous!

DOROTHY: Why, Roger? You are so cruel! Why is it preposterous?

ROGER: Dorothy, knock it off! Don't you understand the situation we're in?

DOROTHY: I understand. A villain has kidnapped the man that I work for -- the man that I love.

ROGER: R. Dorothy Wayneright!

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Originally posted by Pythagoras You wouldn't see anything strange in humping a piece of metal? Roger sure does.

Do you mean as strange as Roger asking a 'piece of metal' for "mouth to mouth" in Act 26?

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Originally posted by Pythagoras You wouldn't see anything strange in humping a piece of metal? Roger sure does.

Roger sure did. At the start of the series he was gaga over her until he learned she was an android. Then he became even more of a louse than usual for a while, outright insulting her by saying she was just mimicing humans, questioning her playing the blues, etc.

By the end of the series though, he was willing to risk his life to save hers, bought her flowers on a whim (well, there was a whim involved there somewhere, though he probably planned the buying and giving out long in advance), and even expressed his sorrow when she was deactivated by Beck's removal of her core memory. By the end of the series I honestly don't think he cared any longer whether she was an android or not. He loved her, plain and simple. He loved her enough to risk his life facing Alan Gabriel (twice!) to get her back. He loved her enough to bring her home and lay her out in state in his demolished living room, beside her beloved piano when she was deactivated. When she again came to his rescue, at the bottom of the sea, he joked about "mouth to mouth", and he looked damn pleased to have her by his side as he faced down Alex in Big Fau and Angel/Big Venus there at the end.

So what if they've never kissed on screen? They don't need to do that. It's clear by the end of the series that they're together, now and forever. Everyone else had seen it coming for a long time, Norman and Beck longest of all, I'd say. Even Angel admitted it before the end and apoligized to Dorothy for it (though Dorothy was a bit spiteful and didn't accept it). Hell, Oliver and Laura saw it in them at their first meeting! So, after all that, I'd say that Roger probably wouldn't "mind humping a piece of metal". To him, R. Dorothy Wayneright is far more than that. She is the love of his life, his soulmate, whether her body is flesh and bone or metal and whatever her skin is made of. And best of all, this time things seem to be working out better for them. Both survived the new Event, after all. Both died alone the last time, Roger just before and Dorothy just after.

And as to your opening post, regarding Act 14 and "Roger's Self-made hell", frankly, if that's the truth that you want to accept, so be it. Personally, I'd rather have something more fulfilling than that.

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Originally posted by Big Ben And in a worst case scenariio we can rebuild her. We have the technology. Better, stronger, more...*ahem*...functional than before.

I did a fanfic

(Begin shameless self-promotion)
Beneath the Surface
(end shameless self-promotion)

that covered some of the necessary technical aspects that would make *functional* possible... It really isn't as far-fetched as it might seem.

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Originally posted by BigPrime quote: Originally posted by Pythagoras You wouldn't see anything strange in humping a piece of metal? Roger sure does. Roger sure did. At the start of the series he was gaga over her until he learned she was an android. Then he became even more of a louse than usual for a while, outright insulting her by saying she was just mimicing humans, questioning her playing the blues, etc. By the end of the series though, he was willing to risk his life to save hers, bought her flowers on a whim (well, there was a whim involved there somewhere, though he probably planned the buying and giving out long in advance), and even expressed his sorrow when she was deactivated by Beck's removal of her core memory. By the end of the series I honestly don't think he cared any longer whether she was an android or not. He loved her, plain and simple. He loved her enough to risk his life facing Alan Gabriel (twice!) to get her back. He loved her enough to bring her home and lay her out in state in his demolished living room, beside her beloved piano when she was deactivated. When she again came to his rescue, at the bottom of the sea, he joked about "mouth to mouth", and he looked damn pleased to have her by his side as he faced down Alex in Big Fau and Angel/Big Venus there at the end. So what if they've never kissed on screen? They don't need to do that. It's clear by the end of the series that they're together, now and forever. Everyone else had seen it coming for a long time, Norman and Beck longest of all, I'd say. Even Angel admitted it before the end and apoligized to Dorothy for it (though Dorothy was a bit spiteful and didn't accept it). Hell, Oliver and Laura saw it in them at their first meeting! So, after all that, I'd say that Roger probably wouldn't "mind humping a piece of metal". To him, R. Dorothy Wayneright is far more than that. She is the love of his life, his soulmate, whether her body is flesh and bone or metal and whatever her skin is made of. And best of all, this time things seem to be working out better for them. Both survived the new Event, after all. Both died alone the last time, Roger just before and Dorothy just after.

Well, I didn't say that very nicely but still, I think that his love for her is non-sexual (though not wholly non-sexual). Roger wants Angel but he loves Dorothy. One can certainly love someone (a non-family member) a great deal and not want to make it sexual. I've seen this in my own life and in others'. One can be willing to die for someone and not want to take it to sexual level for a variety of reasons.

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And as to your opening post, regarding Act 14 and "Roger's Self-made hell", frankly, if that's the truth that you want to accept, so be it. Personally, I'd rather have something more fulfilling than that.

Actually, I'd prefer that I'd be proved wrong. We'll never know if Roger's world is fake unless Sunrise and Cartoon Network commission more episodes. I'll bet, though, that the first episode of any subsequent run is going to have a similar tone to "Roger the Wanderer." It has to. The writers raised some very serious, dada-esque questions as to what is real within the show in many episodes, particularly at the beginning and end of Season 2.

Another name for Act 14 could have been "Roger Smith, This is your life!"